Belonging: The Friendship Crisis Nobody Talks About

FAWN: [00:00:00] paying attention to what so many people are challenged with, there is one theme to acknowledge and understand that will bring us back to having friendships and community. It's the crisis of belonging. Not loneliness, not loneliness exactly. Belonging. Today we're asking some questions that will hopefully bring some clarity And also think about what if friendship is less about compatibility and more about recognition? Not do we agree, not do we have the same interests, but can I see the divine image in you even when you're struggling? Thank you for joining us. Here we go Welcome back to Our Friendly World, everybody. MATT: Hello, everyone. FAWN: People are surrounded by information, connected digitally, busier than [00:01:00] ever, yet a lot of people feel unseen, unknown, and disconnected. Disconnected from meaningful community. There's increased loneliness, anxiety, social isolation, and less and less neighborly and workplace friendships even. There are lots of people who have contact, but less genuine connection There is a philosophy that I wanna get into today that will help. It's the idea that our purpose for being here, of existing is to create a home for love to exist and to live. This might seem like a mystical concept, but what if friendship is one of the primary ways that that happens? Not because friendship makes us feel good, because friendship creates a place where another soul can fully arrive. In other words, belonging is a spiritual act. Look, these days in the quote, unquote "modern [00:02:00] world," we ask ourselves, "Where do I belong?" What if we ask, "How do I help another soul belong?" So what's the big idea? Most people think friendship is about finding people who understand us, but maybe friendship is actually the practice of becoming a safe place where another person can reveal who they are. Our job is to see the unique divine spark in every person There's this beautiful thought that every soul comes into the world with a unique mission. That means every person you meet is carrying something irreplaceable. Friendship becomes the sacred art of helping another person remember who they are. Not fixing them, not rescuing them, not changing them. Helping them remember. This feels really timely to me right now because so many people seem to be wondering if [00:03:00] they matter, if they are seen Where there are place is. Your place is where your soul can contribute its unique light Before we get into the questions that I have, do you have any comments? MATT: I would, I would say absolutely it's about creating a safe space. And it, I find the easiest way, for me anyways, to create a safe space is to offer up a challenging story, witticism about my own self. Not necessarily self-deprecating, although those can work. But, you know, in, in, in sharing a secret-ish with other people, it makes them more comfortable to share their secrets. If their secret is that they're, um, uh, a secret opera fanatic and, you know, they've been ridiculed for that in the past. If they know something about you that, you know, could be open to scrutiny or ridicule and you're okay with [00:04:00] it, it makes-- You're, you're, you're making a more comfortable space for everyone. FAWN: So you're saying create a space where people are comfortable enough where they can feel they belong here. MATT: Right. FAWN: Okay. MATT: And it starts with, you know, sharing something. FAWN: Well, that goes back to what you have always said is to be a good host. MATT: Right. FAWN: So even if you're out on the street, and obviously that's not your home, but the world is our home. Right. And a stranger, even a stranger is your guest. So our job is to make everyone feel comfortable. Yes. So, okay, I'm just gonna get into some questions. Question number one. When was the last time someone made you feel like you truly belonged? I can't even remember MATT: That's an easy FAWN: one. No, actually... What? Okay, go ahead. MATT: That's an easy one. So, my wife comes bustling into my place of business. Well, no, I was hanging out with the boys at the gas station. Oh my God. Oh, yeah. Needed a [00:05:00] Gatorade. Oh my God. FAWN: Okay, okay, okay, back up. So yeah- ... I was, I was late for work, and Matt, Matt hangs out with the guys at the gas station super early in the morning. I was late for work, and I had something close to a heat stroke the day before on the job, and I was still not feeling well the next day. Nothing was helping, and I was feeling still a d- dizzy, just unwell, but I had to go to work, right? At the last second, I'm like, "Ugh, as much as I don't like the stuff, like I don't think it's healthy, I need, I think I need a Gatorade." MATT: You need electrolytes. FAWN: So I went to the gas station, and I was running late, and right when I pull up, everybody, like it was- MATT: Everybody and their third cousin showed up and queued up FAWN: Oh, oh my goodness, there were so many people, and a lot of- ... people who were like, a l- it was a lot of landscape designers, like all their big trucks were there. And they were also in a [00:06:00] hurry to get their stuff so they could go on- Right ... the job site. So anyway, I walk in to this party. I've never seen that place like that before. MATT: It was a zoo. FAWN: You didn't even know I was standing in front of you. I MATT: know. FAWN: And I was kinda like looking at you like, "Hey." And then you didn't, and I was late, so I'm like, "Forget it." So I went around you. You didn't even see me. MATT: I, I saw you when you went around me, but yes. FAWN: Okay, go ahead. I'm sorry. MATT: Ah. FAWN: Back to the last time you felt MATT: you FAWN: belonged. MATT: So, yeah, I knew you had to score something, and so I stood in line. FAWN: Oh, yeah, and MATT: I'm not- I immediately stood in line because- And I'm not used to- the line was getting crazy, gonna get, about to get crazy. FAWN: I was gonna say, I'm not used to shopping in a place like that, and the last time I got a Gatorade was like three years ago. So the packaging has changed, so I didn't know what I was looking at, and I'm in a hurry, and I was just, there were so many different choices. I'm like, "Where's the Gatorade?" So it felt like we were at home. I'm like, "Matt, where's the [00:07:00] Gatorade?" MATT: Anyways, so I got out of line. I found the Gatorade for you. The r- well, we, between us, we found the right Gatorade, and you know what? One of the people who works there is like, "Go. I know Matt'll cover it, so life is good." FAWN: Oh, first she, she said, "Are you Fawn?" And she introduced herself, and I thought that was so sweet. She cut my hurried, , anxiety-ridden ki with such loveliness. Like, "Hi, it's nice to meet you." I'm like, "Oh my God. Hi, thank you so much. Hello." It was nice. It, it, it brought levity and some love- Right to a very crazy, stressful, hurry-up kind of morning. MATT: anyways, she's like, " Don't worry, Matt'll pay for it later." And then you were like, "Oh, do you have money? Do you have money? Do you have money?" FAWN: Right. "Do you have [00:08:00] cash, honey?" I mean- And MATT: I was like, "Yeah, I do," the first time, but then you asked, like, three more times 'cause you're in that mode. FAWN: Well, I just wanted to make sure everyone knew- And then- I wasn't walking out with something- And then- ... without paying for it. So I wanted to make sure that they knew, 'cause all these people were in line, and then here I come. I grab something, and then I'm out. Mm-hmm. So I wanted people to know that someone was gonna pay for it. Right. MATT: And then, so you leave, and of course the guys heard, "Do you have enough money?" And, uh, uh, two of the guys, the two closest, in point of fact, both said, "We got you covered if you don't have it." FAWN: Yeah. MATT: So boom, boom, boom. FAWN: So that made me feel so good when I heard that. There you MATT: go. FAWN: Yeah, you're right. I was gonna say, I don't remember the last time I felt like I belonged, but you're right. I did feel such love and community right there. I did feel like I belonged, especially in a place I, I never go to. Right. You know? And, and yeah, they treated me so special. It was really nice. MATT: And what's so nice on the, uh, uh, y- uh, the upshot as far as, like, se- uh, [00:09:00] sharing secret stories or whatever, I have mispronounced a number of words for them, and my God, do they keep track of them, but in a nice way. FAWN: Mm-hmm. MATT: So yeah. So it's not Gunwale, it's Gunnel. It's not... And on and on and on. FAWN: Okay. MATT: But, uh, but yeah. FAWN: All right. Are we ready for the next question? MATT: Yes. FAWN: All right. Okay. Is belonging something we find or something we create? MATT: Well, the easy answer to that is yes. FAWN: It's both then. MATT: Right. I mean, at work now, John and I are in the process of creating a space. One of the issues that we're having right now is that the host absolutely has a big responsibility for the space, absolutely, but the guests have to hold up their end, too. FAWN: Can I tell you something? MATT: Mm-hmm. FAWN: Um, it's a, it's a thought that I had this week because I was reading a book and it was talking about being deliberate, uh, not drifting. It was [00:10:00] all about making sure you command your life the way you wanna create it. Of course, you work with the higher realms, you know, you're not in control of everything, but to the best of your ability, you better take charge of your life and make a plan. Don't just drift. So I was thinking about that in regards to friendship, and I thought, "Wow, I think all these years I have been thinking, 'Oh, I'll be in a situation and I'll come together with our friends.'" And, you know, it hasn't quite worked out for me. And all of a sudden I switch that thought back to being in command of the situation. I'm like, "No, I'm going to look for my friends and choose who I wanna be friends with instead of being put in a situation where I bump into someone that may be the [00:11:00] friend." Do you know what I'm saying? I do. I am now putting a job application out there to the, to the world. Mm-hmm. Do you know what I'm saying? I do. Maybe job application is not the right word, but like a concise, like I am seeking and looking for certain criteria of who I'm going to bring into our circle. So that's been the mind shift I've had this week, and to me that is about belonging. So yes to both, like you said. Next question. MATT: Yes. FAWN: Okay. What's the difference between being accepted and being truly known? MATT: I think there's a process, and it starts with you feeling like you're being accepted, and that leads you to more openness, which really turns it into belonging. FAWN: And that's how people get to know you. MATT: Right. FAWN: [00:12:00] Great answer. MATT: And it's, it's, it's about, again, creating, making sure , if you're playing the role of host, and these roles are fluid and can change, but if you're playing the role of host, it is your job to make the other person feel comfortable and welcome, you know? And that's what it is. And, at any point, either party can choose to deepen the relationship by actions, by deeds, by the whole thing. There's another guy who stops by the gas station who's fascinating. He's really funny. He's a geek. He's geeky. He's fascinating. And I just had to ask him one day, you know, "What do you do? What, what, what, what is your job?" 'Cause I expe- honestly, I expected him to say he was a programmer. I mean, he's a funny guy. He comes in, he's like, "Welcome to the gun show." He, you know, looking, you know, we comment when he's dressed up. We're like, "Ooh, looking sharp today." FAWN: Welcome to the gun show, and people in other countries that are listening- Oh MATT: dear, that's FAWN: right it's talking about muscles on the arms. MATT: Muscles on the arms. FAWN: They call them guns. [00:13:00] Welcome to our gun fanatic culture. MATT: But he's a total, he's like a total, like, geek. As it turns out, he's not a programmer, he's an accountant. But we're starting, you know, it's almost like we're, we're starting to do the dance of, you know, 'cause he said, "Well, what do you do?" And he had to bring it up the next time he saw me. You know, "Oh, you're a programmer. You're the magic makers," blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, because- FAWN: Wait, so what does he, what does he do? MATT: He's an accountant, actually. FAWN: Oh, wow. MATT: But he's funny. FAWN: Yeah. MATT: I- it's li- it's like, it's like I love it when my prejudices get smacked I- on the head, right? And that's, again, what happens, for me at least, that's the thing I enjoy the most about know- learning people, creating safe spaces and whatnot, because, you know, all of a sudden you're gonna find out that somebody's a backgammon fanatic or, they follow the competitive world of baseball card collecting or something. FAWN: So accepting and being known. Yeah. You mentioned action. I think that you can say whatever you [00:14:00] say, but to be truly known is to be looked at by your actions. Like, it takes time for you to live and walk your walk, and that's what you become known for, whatever that is, good or bad. MATT: Right. FAWN: All right, next question. Are you ready? MATT: Mm-hmm. FAWN: Okay. Um, this is something we've talked about forever. Why are people more connected than ever and yet more lonely? MATT: It's the organic component. It's missing. You're missing. You don't feel it. When I send a text message saying, "Thank you," period, right? People are gonna hear that as very deadpan. FAWN: Or you're yelling c- if, if you're of a- If it's, if it's all MATT: caps or- ... younger FAWN: generation. No, no. Oh, promp- MATT: you're right. No, because- Proper punctuation can infer yelling. FAWN: Yeah. Right. MATT: You know? Which is ridiculous FAWN: to me. MATT: And just because people like this one thing [00:15:00] I said, I may be, like crazy, the 99 things I said before nobody cared about. So it's like they're only taking a look at a tiny sliver of who you are or who you were that day. They're not taking a look at you as a person. They're not feeling you, seeing you as a person. So on some level, they're not seeing you at all. I'm a firm believer in the organic component. FAWN: Yeah, but how do you explain that when you're with people in person, you're connected, but so lonely? I mean, you can say that with people that are in relationships or marriages, or they're in a crowded room still feeling very lonely. Again, the organic thing is there because you're there together, but on a deeper level, the organic thing is perhaps There are walls up for some reason, or what else is it that you feel so lonely [00:16:00] even when you're physically with people? MATT: Well, I can take it to my job. I work with 100 at least other people, and it's all open office and open desks and the whole bit, right? Which means you don't really get a chance to know anybody until you start breaking down those barriers. And the one of the w- and the easiest way to break down those barriers is by saying hello. And yet there's such a, " Ah, I don't wanna, I don't wanna," aspect to it, and I don't know why. You're, you're nervous, you're ashamed, you're afraid somebody'll say, "Who are you?" You know? It, it feels very grade school, and you just kinda gotta figure out how to muscle through it, and you also have to figure out how to muscle through rejection. FAWN: Well, I think really one of the other things is the dirty four-letter word again, busy. MATT: Right. FAWN: Even at work, you're too busy, so how do you have time to, have [00:17:00] a genuine, real connection? But then again, in marriages or in families, you're not working, but again, you're too busy. Your mind is occupied. You're occupied, so you're not even aware of the other person. MATT: Right, and you saw that with me yesterday. My brain was very occupied thinking about stuff. Honestly, it was thinking about it's been thinking about the project that I'm currently working on, and, and, and, and, and, and, and sometimes it is hard to break away. But I think you have a responsibility to break away, and if the other person is unwilling to do so That's kind of a, uh, that's- FAWN: And, and it kind MATT: of- ... that's kind of a deal breaker FAWN: But it's not just about un- being unwilling. It's just, again, the dirty four-letter word, busy. You're so busy that you're not able to even... I have [00:18:00] things to do, like I'm being torn in different directions, and one kid is going nuts, and you, you're, like, thinking about work and everything, and I'm thinking about work too, but this kid is going nuts over here, our kid, and it's scary, and it's just, like, messing up the family, uh, and I, I'm just overwhelmed and I'm tired. Busy and tired. MATT: Right. FAWN: So I'm... Gosh, that's, that's a big thing that we need to talk about for many hours and try to figure out how we can fix that, but there you go. But that's the reason, I think, why more people are connected than ever before, yet totally lonely. All right. Should we just go to the next question, or do you wanna talk... Do you have anything more to say about that? MATT: Let's, let's proceed on because that's- FAWN: Okay ... MATT: there's a whole show idea behind that. FAWN: All right. So, okay. Can friendship become a [00:19:00] spiritual home? Absolutely, yes, and I think that's what marriage is. It better be that or no thank you. Do you know what I'm saying? MATT: I think- FAWN: No thank you. MATT: I th- honestly, for me, my relationships, if they're, if they're online or via the phone, it's a very kind of mental relationship. I think in-person relationships, they start physical and then they go mental. And then they go mental. Anyways, um, and then once you really break through and you really are feeling that safe space, that safe, comfortable space, then the spiritual starts to come. It's kind of a more ultimate level of the whole thing to me. FAWN: So what's your answer? Can friendship become a spiritual home? MATT: Absolutely. It takes, it takes time though. FAWN: I mean, I feel like things need to be holy. So things need to be clean and clear. No garbage, no... What do you [00:20:00] call it, Matt? Flot- flotsam and jetsam? MATT: Flotsam and jetsam. FAWN: Flotsam and jetsam. MATT: You could call it cruft- FAWN: No, MATT: riffraff ... you could call it kipple, you could call it a lot of things. FAWN: You know, the, it, you need to have a sacred space- MATT: You FAWN: do ... to have a spiritual home. MATT: But to me the, and the other aspect is, is the other person has to really know you. FAWN: Yeah. It, it needs to be- And MATT: you have to be- ... a sacred space ... comfortable really knowing them too. FAWN: And in that sacred space, there are certain things that need to happen: trust, love, compassion. What else needs to be in there? Do you know what I'm saying? Right. To have that, that circle of, that, that circle, that, that home, that, that spiritual home. MATT: Right. FAWN: What else would you put in there? MATT: No, that, no, that's good. There's a, there's a, there's a pithy saying that I keep holding onto lately that I, I heard, which was basically the gist of it is, "You have to earn the right to criticize me." FAWN: Hmm. " MATT: I'm not gonna pay attention to you if you haven't earned the right to criticize me." FAWN: [00:21:00] Hmm. MATT: That's a fun one. FAWN: Hmm. MATT: That's a fun unpack on that one. It's true FAWN: though. It's good. MATT: It's like I'm, it... Unless I respect you, I'm not gonna, I'm gonna reject your criticisms. FAWN: Okay. So the next question I have is actually going, it seems like it's going back to the other one we had, when we're so connected, why are we feeling so lonely? It's kind of like that, but here's the question. You ready? MATT: Mm-hmm. FAWN: What prevents us from helping others feel seen? What prevents us from helping others feel seen? Because if we're not seen, if we constantly want to prove ourselves or explain ourselves, then we're always in the telling mode, showing mode, and We're not comfortable enough. You know, like- Mm-hmm ... the air hasn't been let out of us enough for us to go (big exhale) and then look at [00:22:00] someone and go, "Hey, what are you about? What are you doing?" Do you know what I'm saying? MATT: I do. I do, and this is the hard part because starting from a dead stop is the problem here. 'Cause honestly, for me, FAWN: I- What do you mean, starting from a dead stop? MATT: Starting from a dead stop. FAWN: What are you talking about? MATT: Okay, so for me it's all give and take, right? It's all give and take, and so, you know, when I get involved in a new social situation, I feel like I bring currency, I bring attention with me, because it's like I've gotten recently recognized, and the Gatorade example's a perfect one. That's something I can carry with me for the next, week, two weeks of somebody absolutely seeing me, seeing problems, offering to help. That compassionate currency I'm taking with me, and I can, I can spend some and not feel [00:23:00] depleted. And that's the other thing, because oftentimes, if nobody's recognizing us, then it's hard for us to recognize others. Mm-hmm. 'Cause we just feel like, "I just give and give and give. I just... You know, can I please have something?" So in my case, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm holding my little bag of money, and I can spend some here, there, and everywhere, and I know that I've, I'll have more money coming in. And but the hard part is, is when you don't and you're at that dead stop. You, it's like you almost need to get involved in a situation where you are seen. FAWN: Mm-hmm. MATT: So for me, I think impossible unless I do something that makes me feel good. So even before the gas station crew, I'd go on long cycle rides, and I would, on those long cycle rides, sometimes I would find a cyclist who was about my skill level, as it were, or fitness level, and I would just pair up with [00:24:00] them and have a banal conversation, frankly. But it gave me just a little bit of currency. FAWN: Mm-hmm. MATT: And I could give them a little currency. And it was a good ride, and, you know, I don't even know the names of these people, and I don't know if I'll ever see them again. But, you know, I find out about so-and-so's grandkids and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, 'cause of course I'm riding with octogenarians 'cause they're at my fitness level. But let's not dwell on that. But, you know, it, it feels like we had the back and forth, and so it's about trying to find those kinds of spaces where you can, uh, you can connect even if just for a minute, and then take that momentum, and now you're slowly pushing the rock. FAWN: So is it kind of like, uh, being in survival mode? And if you're in survival mode, you can't see... You're pretty myopic, so you can't see details. MATT: Right. FAWN: You're, you're tunnel visioned. MATT: Right. And so it's, it's about building what you can from any small interaction. FAWN: Okay. MATT: But- [00:25:00] And then build, and then make those- Right ... bigger and bigger and bigger as you start, like, building, let's-- I don't wanna call it a support network, it's a friend network. Mm-hmm. But in many ways it is a support network. FAWN: Uh, well, yeah. Absolutely. That's what relationships are. Okay. So how do you think our communities could change if we treated belonging as a sacred responsibility? MATT: A- AA is a perfect example of this. When you- FAWN: Alcoholics Anonymous? MATT: Yes. When you go to a meeting, everybody is gonna talk to you if it's your first meeting, period, end of story. Because they wanna create- Your FAWN: responsibility is to be a good host. MATT: Exactly. So unfort- fortunate or unfortunately, it looks like we're gonna 12 step this one. But, uh, you know, I remember going to an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting because the woman I was dating at the time was going to them, and I just wanted to experience it. And, you know, it was a cool thing [00:26:00] because even if you're, like, the biggest kind of awkwardest whatever, they would... That's an excellent exa- God, I never thought about that before, but that's an excellent example of being a good host because, you know, a- and it's an excellent example of people sharing vulnerabilities, and it's just an excellent example in building a community FAWN: Yeah. I have nothing more to add to that. MATT: Jeez, I hadn't even... Boom. This one caught me by surprise. FAWN: Yeah. I mean, they are good examples of being a good host. And it is like- Free coffee ... a sacred space, right? Like, there was a every morning, early in the morning, I would walk by and some of my friends from the neighborhood would be all standing outside, in front of a business that was closed because it was too early in the morning. I'm like: "What are you doing here?" And they were so, um, they were so fishy with their response. Like they didn't want [00:27:00] to answer. And it was in front of a whole group of, a bunch of people from the neighborhood. Mm-hmm. And we all knew each other. I'm like: "Seriously, what are you guys doing?" "What are you hanging out here for? You wanna come with me over here? Or I'm gonna go out for coffee. You wanna come?" "No." "What are you doing?" "Oh, w- we have some plans." Like so cagey. And then finally one of them broke down and he's like: "Fawn, we're waiting for an AA meeting to start." I'm like: "Oh, I'm sorry. Okay. See you later. Bye." But it was sacred, you know? Like it, I felt it like, oh my goodness, and I so pride... It kind of reminds me of the time I was on an airplane and I was trying to make friends with someone that was sitting next to me, and he was, uh, he seemed like a martial artsy guy, and he was reading like a martia- martial artsy book. And I'm like: "Oh my God, we have so much in common." I was trying to talk to him and like get things out of him. Like: "Hey, where are you going? What are you doing? Who are you? What do you do?" [00:28:00] And somehow later I found out he was one of those, uh, air marshals. MATT: Oh, that's right. He was a sky marshal. FAWN: Remember? Yeah. Do we still have those, by the way? MATT: I think we still do. FAWN: Wow. Okay. All right. So do you have anything more to add? MATT: Not a whisper. FAWN: So here's a wrap up, a conclusion. So in a world that increasingly offers connection without belonging, friendship is probably one of the last sacred places where we can be fully seen. And maybe the greatest gift we can give another human being is the feeling that they are in a loving embrace where they can grow roots, thrive, nourish, and be nourished. So initially I wanted to say like, I wanted to say, so they feel like [00:29:00] they're home, but home may not be good, a good example for others. Like some people are triggered by the word love, you know? Mm-hmm. Because maybe they're heartbroken. So I, I didn't wanna say a home, but you know, a place that makes you feel good, a place that makes you thrive. So that's it. MATT: All right. FAWN: That's it for this week. The thought for this week. Have a beautiful every day. MATT: Be well, everyone. FAWN: If you need us, we're here. Reach out. We'll talk to you soon. MATT: Bye-bye.