After the Show Conversation with Joey Krikorian

Join us for more conversation with our friend Joey as we get more relaxed and talk about Star Wars, pasta, geology, music, Armenia, and our next episode together and all the things we did not get a chance to talk about (about the root of why things happen the way they do).

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Matt: And just because this could be interesting, but yes, I want to talk about man and his sense of smell, but that's going to be handled in the next show, which is great. I also wanted to talk about, you know, there is a tradition, an Italian tradition as far as like, um, you know, pasta comes from the far east and the Italians have quote-unquote made it their own so that the, and during the Roman empire, they grabbed spices from everywhere they could grab it from the spice road, for instance, I mean, God, that that's a culture addicted to spice, right? Yeah.

Also Joey. I wanted to mention something very interesting. There is a book it's actually two books, the graphic novels it's called "Maus", M A U S

[00:00:43] Joey: a hundred percent.

[00:00:44] Matt: He actually talks about how his father didn't want to tell his stories. And he actually gets an explanation from his father and then his father completely changes his tune, but very, very powerful series of books.

[00:00:57] Joey: I think I want to say something to the first point you've made, which is that I should've said this one thing my Armenian grandfather always did as much as we didn't talk about anything else related to Armenia, anything, anything in the world he would point to and say, Armenians invented that, or that was Armenian pasta, grape leaves.

I don't know any, anything, anywhere. That was his go-to thing. And it's like something, it was just part of my. Childhood hearing. Right? So it never, like, it was always just a thing, you know, it was always just a thing in my life. So, uh, I never really asked any questions or anything, but looking back that was pretty fun and entertaining and pretty much the truth.

You know what I mean? I get it. I get it.

[00:01:46] Matt: And for

[00:01:48] Joey: go ahead, go ahead. If we're continuing down that same line. Okay. Well to "Maus". Yes. And what a great book and what a great like. EV everyone should read it. You know, there were these, I could talk forever about this, but there are these points where like there's stuff that everyone should watch and read.

And some of it's animated, TV shows and people are so turned off by that, but there's stuff in there and there's stuff like graphic novels, like "MAUS",

and there's stuff like "They Called Us Enemy" a graphic memoir by George Takei about spending part of his childhood in an internment camp in the United States. And it's incredibly emotional and it's his story and it's a graphic memoir and it's just like, everyone should read it. And there's people like we're talking about, like, we're talking about people not knowing what the Armenian genocide is.

There's so many people in this country that grow up not being taught about Japanese internment camps and other things like that, that happened in this country. So right along the same line of "Maus" in my mind is this graphic memoir. It's called, uh, by George Takei called and "They Called Us

[00:03:07] Matt: Enemy"

there is a number of them. I mean, in Japan, there's a series called "Barefoot Gen", or gen G E N. The whole thing about it's the story of Hiroshima, Jesus Christ. That's not going to be a good story, right. But it's again, very visceral and powerful graphic novel. And then to tie us back to "Maus" for just a second, there's a, there's a scene in the story where he's walking down the street.

He it's it's and it's during the scary time. And he walks by a guy and the guy says , which means, I guess, in Yiddish. And I've probably just butchered it. Uh, it means what does it mean our tribe or it's w and he said it in. And he like hesitated. Like, do I answer him? Do I not answer him? And that takes us to, again, back to Italy and Rome, uh, during the days when the Christians were persecuted, the way that they would say do exactly that exact same thing as they would, they would draw a fish on the ground and then they'd scratch it out because the fish was the early symbol of Christianity.

[00:04:06] Joey: Interesting. I wonder if there's something. I wonder if there's something similar in Armenia, because there was this, that, you know, Christianity, they were Christians. That's what instigated that conflict, that genocide. So I wonder if there's something similar there, it might have something, maybe it has something to do with some of these Gotah Gotah stamps, you know, and if you all want to put this in somewhere, I was really thinking about it the whole time we were talking.

Cause we started with Star Wars and then we went into. Um,

[00:04:37] Matt: we went everywhere.

[00:04:38] Joey: We went everywhere, but we went into previous generations or the generation, the people involved in a horrible atrocity, like a genocide, and then subsequent generations not talking about it. And I think it's very interesting.

You know, we talked about the empire blowing up alderaan. No one talks about it. Like Leah, doesn't talk about in any of the rest of the movies. Right. And I think that's a very relatable thing, you know, there's a little bit more to it in the books. And she goes back and traces her history to Nibu and, and being sort of Royal airs to Nibu and stuff like that.

But, uh, I mean, it's a very similar experience. Her people were killed and. She never talks about it again. And I think if you watch those movies through a lens like that, it means so much more. Whereas if you just watch it on its face there going through the movies, certain plot points have to be hit.

Stuff happens. But if you look at it with that lens, it's an actual choice that was made. That's a very real of not talking about the atrocity. That was, that just occurred.

[00:05:46] Fawn: I have a thought, I have a. Uh, and I, and I mentioned this to you, Joey, in the notes when we were on zoom, once I said, you know, it's the whole thing about fitting in, fitting in, not talking about something makes you fit in, but it also makes us the killers because we're doing the job of the people that killed by killing our own culture by not talking about it.

And by not living it and embracing. We are continuing the pillaging.

[00:06:21] Joey: Yeah. I think there's so much fear involved in that, right. Because of, because of who they were, they were murdered. And so you flee that, like my great-grandparents fled the Armenian genocide. I don't know how they interacted with the world when they got here.

You know, they were living in, I presume they were living in like little Armenia, what used to be little Armenia in New York and maybe able to feel more themselves and interact with other people of their culture. But I think there's so much fear in that because you were so heavily persecuted for being who you were.

You don't want that you don't want to be that again. So you feel like you have to change for that and you feel like you have to change to fit in just so deeply so that you can just exist peacefully so that you're not harassed or murdered or bothered or any, anything,

[00:07:16] Fawn: you know what guys think about all the anxiety that's going on in the world.

And a lot of people from all shades white to every shade, um, there's this thing happening of major anxiety and not knowing what the anxiety is. So they're just prescribed pills for. But guaranteed. A lot of it comes from, ancestral stories that are passed down. Think about, I mean, talk about like it experiencing genocide and then coming to a completely different place.

Not only experiencing culture shock, but you have PTSD, you know, a term that we can now give these days, but like, Post-traumatic stress disorder. How does that translate? And how does it translate to the following generations? I wonder if that's where the true cause of such unknown anxiety that people are prescribed pills for these days really comes from because

it gets perpetuated because we're not talking about it. So it, the more you don't know, the more anxious you feel, it's like people that have a disease and they feel terrible. And then there's a term placed on the disease. Like a doctor will say, oh, you have such and such, the person ends up feeling relief because it has a name.

Yeah. Do you know what I mean? If you don't know where it's coming from, it's even worse because you don't know what danger you're looking out for.

[00:08:56] Joey: It's such an anxious atmosphere everywhere. So many people feel like they don't fit in whether you're black or brown or LGBTQ plus, or there's just so many people that get bullied or, uh, discriminated again.

Anyway, there's just so much of that, that no one can ever feel like they can be their selves in any given situation. So that anxious pressure presence and pressure is just always there.

[00:09:31] Fawn: And if you don't fit in, you won't have a good job. You can't make a living. You can't have enough food to eat. Yeah.

[00:09:41] Joey: Uh, what's the name of that movie?

Ah,

We're getting real,

[00:09:51] Fawn: by the way. I'm turning this into an after show. Oh my goodness. Going to air it

[00:09:56] Matt: one more point

[00:09:57] Fawn: to make, but make it, this'll be like after show, show.

[00:10:02] Joey: Yeah. I can't find the movie, but I will. Well, give us, give us a description. It's this like? It turns into a weird scifi thing, but the like two thirds of it, the premise is that there's this like telemarketer company or customer service company that the black people who work there need to have white people, voices in order to communicate with the people on the phone, in order to have like a good experience with the customer.

They like have white people, voices

[00:10:32] Matt: as interesting Slumdog millionaire played with that concept too.

[00:10:36] Joey: It came out much, like much later after that

[00:10:39] Matt: so completely understand the last point I wanted to make, which is interesting. But if you want to get into kind of almost the Christian culture, JC last supper broke bread, and that's a big thing inside of Christianity because that, and that takes us into.

You know, this is my body. This is my blood. God, what did I call that? God, I can't believe, I can't remember the ceremony communion. It takes us into communion and that's baked into, um,

[00:11:07] Fawn: Christianity

How about the Jewish culture every Friday night breaking bread with the Challah. Right?

[00:11:15] Matt: Anyways. That's that's

[00:11:16] Fawn: what I got.

You know what we should have, we should do a group, um, like a round table with religious experts. From all religions and some archeologists anthropologists. Are there any anthropologists up there in Wyoming?

[00:11:32] Joey: That'll ask me. I could ask Lorelei if she knows anyone at the university or anywhere

[00:11:37] Fawn: any university

[00:11:38] Joey: crash, she definitely knows anthropologists.

A lot of what she does focuses on anthropology.

[00:11:44] Fawn: Let's do, let's do a round table for another show.

[00:11:47] Matt: Just keep spinning these and spinning these. Ain't never going to get rid of us,

[00:11:50] Joey: Hey, I'm I'm into it. I love this. I absolutely love this. I love talking about it. I love learning about it and I love food and this

[00:11:59] Fawn: is important.

This is important for our society right now. Nobody else is having conversation. You know, they think they are, but they're trying to sell something. You know, I just, I just. I want our friends. I want, I want to develop family here and you're not going to have a true, meaningful family. I mean, knowing firsthand, I grew up in a family and I didn't speak to them.

They didn't speak to me to the point where I can't speak my mother tongue anymore. Like, and I couldn't speak it back then that well either, and they didn't speak English at home. So go figure we had. You know what I mean? Let alone there was no respect. That's another issue. But I'm saying, you know, this is, this is the most important thing we can do is to share and to express ourselves and to find the beauty in everything like this beautiful bread we're going to make.

[00:12:53] Joey: Yes.

[00:12:54] Fawn: So back to your kingdom of nerdiness, I'm so glad you guys met. Because there's you, I think you all have so much in common and now you're quiet and you're staring at me blinking. Matt will just stare and blink at me.

[00:13:10] Matt: Well, I have more to say, but it's going to be off, off the air.

[00:13:13] Fawn: Oh, go ahead.

[00:13:15] Matt: No. Okay. Fine.

Are you wearing a Rush t-shirt

[00:13:21] Joey: I'm not wearing a rush. T-shirt I'm actually wearing a star wars, star wars. T-shirt his cover? Cover Me Porkins.

[00:13:28] Matt: Okay. Okay. I thought it said RUSH on top. I was going to give you another music recommendation, which is why I didn't want it on the show.

[00:13:34] Fawn: Why not? Why can't we do, we should have music recommendations.

[00:13:38] Matt: Fine RUSH. Obviously Sci-Fi connection is 2112. We all know this, right. There was a three CD set that RUSH put out called Different Stages Live, I believe. That is my favorite rendition that they did of 2112. And that includes the 25th century remaster. And that's, I think that ironically includes the original.

So yeah, if you want to get a little bit of your 1976 geek, on via 2112, that would be the one I would recommend.

[00:14:09] Fawn: Um, it rushes American, right?

[00:14:11] Matt: Russia's Canadian Canadian power trio. And unfortunately, Neil Peart passed.

[00:14:16] Fawn: Sorry.

[00:14:17] Matt: I'm sorry to hear that. I was actually once upon a time, I had two degrees of separation from Neil.

Peart nice. What happened? Um, when I worked at DL, there was a woman there who was dating him.

[00:14:33] Fawn: There's always a connection. Is it because we're from LA? Is that it? Joey? We talk about all this, all this, all the time also, but like where we lived, my neighbor was dating, Eddie Van Halen, Eddie Van Halen. And I met Eddie Van Halen initially through the plumbing because we would talk to each other in the bathroom, my neighbor and I would, and so, um, friends who would come over didn't know that.

So like they would use the bathroom. And if I was in the bathroom on my side, I'd be like, Hey, and they would freeze. And the most hysterical moments of had happened, happened in the bathroom. Anyway. So here he is in the bathroom using the bathroom and I'm listening. And then I noticed he didn't wash his hands.

So I started telling him and he was smoking and could smell the smoke as I started berating him over the smoke. And did you wash your hands? And so he comes right over. Laughing hysterically and the fact that here's Eddie van Halen right in front of me. And so Matt always, wore these Vans, these checkered Vans that were outside my door because I'm a shoeless, I've always been a shoeless household.

Like, please leave your shoes at the front. Sure. And so, so he would always comment on Matt's shoes and he would laugh at this note that I had on my, uh, my door that said, please remove your shoes. And so he would laugh. I'm like, what are you laughing at? I don't get it. He's like, I remove Matt's shoes all the time. I re move them.

Like he, he, he would take them and move them over an inch.

[00:16:16] Joey: That's a good joke.

[00:16:18] Fawn: So he would always be touching Matt's shoes and Matt never met Eddie.

[00:16:22] Matt: I never saw him. I never met him. So Matt

[00:16:24] Fawn: was saying, Matt would always say, you're lying. He wouldn't say lying, but you're like, you're making it up. I'm like, dude, he would miss, they wouldn't miss each other by five seconds.

Sometimes

[00:16:35] Joey: it was. That's what I said the same room together, but like the

[00:16:42] Fawn: whole washing the hands thing, the first time we met, so we were laughing hysterically, like all of us, like Eddie, me and my neighbor. And so our other neighbor's walking home from a hard day's work, like he's carrying all his gear and he's walking and his head is down and then he just hears us laughing.

He looks at us, he's like, Hey guys, what's up? And we're talking. And I'm like, oh, I'm just, you know, we're just, um, laughing at washing hands. And then he's like, oh yeah. And then we start talking about the date and then he looks at Eddie and he. The shock on his face. And then he's like, oh, and then, and then, so Eddie van Halen turns to him and he's like, hi, I'm Eddie.

And we just had his hand out, but I had just told them we were laughing over not washing hands. And so my friend would not shake his hand.

[00:17:35] Matt: He didn't wash it.

[00:17:37] Fawn: Yeah. It was crazy, like good times, good times. But like, we always have stories of someone famous and our kids must think we're the biggest liars because we'll watch TV.

I'm like, oh yeah, I photographed that guy. Oh yeah. We, we would hang out and they're like, you did. I'm like, yeah, we did.

[00:18:00] Joey: By the way, that movie "Big Fish". You ever see that movie? I love that.

[00:18:05] Matt: I believe we have, I haven't seen that in a long time, but, um, yeah. Before we go take another step, you know, rest in peace, Neil Peart rest in peace.

Eddie van Halen. Hmm. I can't believe it.

I

[00:18:15] Fawn: know.

I cannot believe it.

I'm sorry. Joey. Did, were you saying something?

[00:18:23] Joey: No, I don't think so.

[00:18:26] Fawn: Matt is crunching on. Chocolate covered espresso beans. Nice crunch. I don't want lunch. I don't want this espresso beans. There would be this song about potato chips

anyway. So what else guys?. What else do you want to talk about

[00:18:47] Matt: next step in jibber, jabbering way too long.

[00:18:52] Joey: I loved this. This was great. I, uh, yeah, I'm excited for our next episode. I

[00:18:59] Matt: had a really great time. I normally don't have this many notes of stuff that I wanted to bring up and I didn't have an opportunity.

[00:19:04] Fawn: You always say that because I talk too much and you don't have a chance to jump in there. And I mean, boom,

[00:19:09] Matt: boom, boom, boom, boom.

[00:19:11] Joey: Now, we've got a second. We've got a second opportunity here. I have some extra notes as well.

[00:19:16] Fawn: There's always so much to talk about. Most of our guests with the exception of one.

Always come back because there's so much to talk about, right?

[00:19:26] Joey: Yeah. I'd love to come back. Well for the baking one, then

[00:19:30] Matt: we haven't even been here. The conversation.

[00:19:32] Fawn: Oh my God. Yeah. We need to teach on geology. Do you have any good stones over there? This is where like

[00:19:38] Joey: dinosaurs

[00:19:39] Fawn: are from. So. It's interesting because our kids, Elle and Alegra w and I, and I noticed a lot of kids did this too.

They, as soon as they could walk, would gravitate towards rocks and stare at them the way you told me that you did when you were little, and they would pick them up and come to me and present these stones to me, like how adults would present a big diamond to someone, you know what I mean? And I would, we would go home with bags, backpack filled with rocks that they've found in the river bed or like wherever we were and they were pets.

Uh, my, do you guys know a long time ago, people had pet rocks and they didn't get what I was saying, but like, no, they were, they were actual entities, like, and I always wondered there's a spiritualness to that. Like there's a spiritualness to scents. I think there's a big spiritual component to the sense of smelling something that brings back memory.

And of course, rocks have been the major force out there that it's been there. It's witnessed everything quietly

[00:20:59] Joey: over and over again. Right? Yeah. It's so interesting that so many kids have such a connection to rocks. Um, yeah. I don't know. You know, we talked last time, I think briefly about connection to dinosaurs, but they were like, everyone's going to be connected to a dinosaurs, this kid, because they were these great behemoth monsters

that ruled the planet. I mean, you're just gonna think that that's cool.

[00:21:23] Fawn: I didn't, I'm sorry. Every time I thought about dinosaurs, it scared the hell out of me because there was this ho I think horrible show Matt liked it, but there was this show a long time ago. What was it called? The land of the lost, but I never

[00:21:38] Matt: saw it because I wasn't allowed to watch like Saturday morning TV.

[00:21:42] Fawn: It's terrifying.

[00:21:44] Joey: It's your

[00:21:45] Fawn: theme song? I was like, oh my God, thank God. I don't have to see that part of history. Like I didn't like, yeah.

[00:21:54] Joey: I loved that show. There was like a remake, there was like an older one sixties or seventies. And then I think they had a remake in the eighties or nineties. And then there was even a movie.

Yeah with Will Ferrell. I probably wouldn't watch that, but anyway, I like that show. I don't mean to, I don't know what the connection is with rocks, you know, but then, so I always love them and I always love fossils and where I grew up in New York, you know, you know what to look for and find a seashell fossils and stuff like that everywhere.

But then growing, knowing I wanted to be a geologist and eventually a paleontologist. but the more you learn about what it really means to be a rock, the more it mattered to me, you know what I mean? And maybe I always had like a scientific mind about it, but the amount of energy and work and lifetimes and stories that went into making any given rock is just incredible geologic history

[00:23:03] Fawn: and the patients are rock has like a normal rock in our modern day. History waiting maybe forever years for someone to come move it's perspective for some little kids come and move it over a few inches or put it in a backpack and it ends up over here.

[00:23:21] Joey: Please remove rocks.

[00:23:27] Fawn: I need a better perspective, a different one. That's what the rock

[00:23:33] Joey: would say, but we're both geologists here and we both have loads of rocks that every time we move, we have to move boxes of,

[00:23:41] Fawn: oh my God, the heaviness. And if you use a moving company, they charge you by the pound.

[00:23:49] Joey: Yeah, we just got a quote for several moving companies and we're probably not doing

that.

[00:23:54] Fawn: So Joey, do you go out there and like, do you, is the term excavate X, X, X?

[00:24:02] Joey: I haven't done much exploring out here. Unfortunately I say that, I feel like I say that to someone every day, but I just haven't gone like out into the wilderness, which is insane because it's the nicest part of being in this place.

Joey.

[00:24:17] Fawn: Did you see that picture? Months ago, a few months ago, it was the, it was like in the midst of the pandemic and it was in Uruguay. These men found this massive piece of, I think it was amethyst and they cut it open, split it in half. Oh, this, I dunno what you call it. A big thing. They score

[00:24:40] Joey: a

[00:24:40] Fawn: crystals inside.

Yeah, do yes. That one. And they split in half and it was in a perfect, the amethyst part, the, the lavender looking part. It was in a perfect heart shape. Did you see that you Google, Google heart shaped amethyst, Uruguay? I think it was 2020.

[00:25:04] Joey: Let's see if it comes up, it popped right up. Do you see

[00:25:07] Fawn: that heart?

[00:25:09] Joey: Let me, so

[00:25:11] Fawn: it's two men and they're still in the field. They had just cracked it open.

[00:25:16] Joey: Yep. That's pretty incredible.

[00:25:23] Fawn: I wanted, I wanted,

[00:25:26] Matt: I want

[00:25:27] Fawn: said, look, I'm afraid of dinosaurs, but I can't get enough of crystals. Yeah,

[00:25:31] Joey: the dark crystal. That's another. Well, what's another good, good nerd. That's that? That's

[00:25:37] Matt: a nerd book and movie

[00:25:39] Joey: old, old Jim Henson. Puppets. Yeah, yeah,

[00:25:44] Matt: yeah. Henson was Hanson was that's all I

[00:25:46] Joey: can say. Yes. Yes.

[00:25:48] Fawn: Agreed. We actually have a Jim Henson quote on our website.

[00:25:52] Matt: Henson Henson, Mr. Muppet, Mr. Sesame street,

[00:25:56] Joey: not darkness in a movie.

Yeah, "The Dark Crystal". I was about, well, it's hard to explain, but there was a crystal involved

[00:26:08] Matt: anyways.

[00:26:09] Fawn: All right. Well, . I don't want to go, but I never want to go.