The Surrogate Friend

What are we substituting in place of real friendship? How is this changing our society? Are we able to notice the spells that are cast in our lives and how they change our friendships? What are these spells? This is our conversation today.

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The Surrogate Friend – TRANSCRIPT

[00:00:00] Fawn: I don't know if I ever showed you this, but there was a vegan cooking show done. Uh, very, I don't know. Is there such a thing as a goth heavy metal guy,

[00:00:10] Matt: that there was no goth

heavy metal, oh dear.

[00:00:13] Fawn: He was very underground, scary sounding. He sounded like a demond,

[00:00:17] Matt: right. But that's not

goth.

That's like when you start getting. into like, I don't know, extreme death

or

[00:00:23] Fawn: he was like that

[00:00:24] Matt: or all the stuff I don't listen to. Cause folks, I love clean vocals makes me a bad person. Then that makes me a

bad person.

[00:00:31] Fawn: Did you show me that? Or did I find it on my own? Probably

[00:00:34] Matt: found it. And this was in that point in time where vegans were completely weird and this certainly didn't help anybody make any kind of a case for it.

[00:00:42] Fawn: But so he was singing with that, like demonic sound. And teaching you how to make vegan Pad Thai in his basement. It wasn't a basement. It was like this underground, like under in the catacombs. I don't know. It was very dark and mysterious and. Crazy soundness, because

[00:01:05] Matt: that was somehow or another going to popularize veganism.

[00:01:09] Fawn: That was just his deal. Cause you know, you, normally you think of vegans as these crazy hippies that are all peace and love, or then you get the hippies that are, very, militant, like our friend Jingles from Santa Monica, or you get the ones that will throw red paint on you.

So, on the subject of media, I have a confession, not really a confession because you've been watching this, but I wanted to explain to you what's been going on with me in the past few years. Definitely since, 2016.

And even before that, I talk about this on our very first show. The fact that I was noticing a change in our society, I was noticing things, getting amped up a lot. Whether it from every aspect of life, things were getting really amped up. For example, there was a lot of racist stuff that was coming towards.

But I never experienced to that degree before. And I dunno if it was because we lived in small towns and we kind of still do right now. Um, but this small town we're in, they think they're so, uh, what's the word for it? They think they're so not racist. They think they're so open-minded and educated and they're far from it.

And I'm talking about the. The yoga Bs anyway. What I've been noticing over the past few years, has been this thing with our society. And that's one of the reasons we're doing our friendly world is to bring about that conversation at our kitchen table, getting back to the art of friendship and reliving that, reeducating ourselves on what the art of friendship truly is.

We're not here to say, this is how you make a friend. This is how you keep a friend. This is, this is how you, you know, we are saying that, but just in the midst of having normal conversations that friends do, even though we're married you and I, we have friends on the show, but even though we're married, we're still friends where it's, we're talking about things that friends would talk about, like the absurdities of life.

And we're trying to figure things out. We are trying to say, did you notice that. Or what's going on with this, let's figure this out, or I feel this way right now, and you may not agree. We may fight, you know, which normally is what happens. All these things that I've been noticing, more and more so I've found that I decided to isolate myself from a lot of people, because I was tired of explaining it to people. Because we have moved from one teeny tiny town to another and trying to educate people on what it is that I'm picking up on or I'm feeling, or the way someone speaks to me, they may not know is incredibly racist or hurtful. And then they get all bent out of shape when you try to go through all these huge lengths to not not offend someone and not say, Hey, you are doing this.

I'm saying, you know, have you noticed in our society, like, this is said, it's quite hurtful. And then they still get all bent out of shape and say, how dare you? You know, I'm very woke, you know, like, whatever. So I feel like especially since 2016, I've become quiet. I feel like I don't really have people to talk to about stuff, which is why I love our podcasts, because thank you.

I feel so heard. This has been the best therapy because I do get to talk, even though we fight on the air, but what I've been doing and. I've had a surrogate friend all along and I've known from the very beginning that I choose this as my surrogate friend. And that's what our show is about today, the surrogate friend. Surrogate is a noun.

The definition is someone who takes the place of another person.

[00:05:19] Matt: Um,

[00:05:20] Fawn: you have a different definition.

[00:05:21] Matt: I prefer definition number three, which has a substitute. It doesn't have to be a person. It can be a group. It can be a thing almost. Um, in computer programming, we talk about talking, keeping a rubber deck on your desk.

And when you run into a problem, explain it to your rubber duck and maybe things will make sense. So you're using that as a sounding board.

[00:05:47] Fawn: Taking the place of, well,

[00:05:49] Matt: yes, absolutely. Still talking about the third thing is not necessarily a

[00:05:52] Fawn: person. Well, for me it feels like a person

[00:05:56] Matt: human connection is extremely important.

Well,

[00:05:59] Fawn: yeah, so this is what's happened. And so I want to explain this without getting political, without saying what side of the fence I'm on, whatever. It doesn't matter. What I'm trying to say is I've noticed this for decades with other people and why certain TV shows are so popular. A lot of TV shows that have friends as the main part of it.

It could be the title could be having nothing to do with the friends, but it's really about the relationship friends have. And I feel like over the decades, people have been using, watching these things as vicariously having a friendship by watching these shows.

[00:06:40] Matt: Right

[00:06:40] Fawn: because you don't have that in real life.

We don't, don't get mad at me. There are the Martine's out there. Martine, my friend from France, Martine is she's a special entity. Everything that you want from having a great friendship that is inspiring to you, is my friend Martine. She lives every day to the fullest. She's not afraid. She laughs at danger.

She laughs at fear. Very rarely has she have I seen her cry, which I'm not saying that's a good thing, but I'm just saying she just lives it up, man. She will live it up. Every day is a party. And I'm not talking like a superficial party either every day is a joyous celebration. She makes the best out of every situation and it's really quite inspiring.

So shout out to my friend, Martine. Um, so anyway, Martine Merbouti Banks, by the way. so here's, here's my confession. You. I'm actually afraid to say it. That's why I'm prolonging getting to the point. Okay. So since 2016, all the frustration and all the things that I've noticed over the last two decades, especially, things that I would come to you with Matt and say, Hey, I'm noticing this,

and you would say, no, it's really not like that. I think you're getting way too, emotional about it. So I feel like, oh my God, I have no one to talk to about this.

When things start happening out in society, things that you have felt throughout all these micro aggressions, all of a sudden it's out in the open and everyone else will, most other people can see it now. Cause it's like, now it's there it is. There it is for everyone to hear and see, and there's no mistaking it.

And so what I started to do was my surrogate friend would be certain TV shows because I've found myself knowingly and quite deliberately going and listening to someone who would have not totally my perspective, but would speak about what I'm feeling because there is no other person. I, I don't, it's not like I have a group of people around me where I can confess these feelings that I'm having, or I can say, Hey, this happened today.

Can we analyze this? Because it's really weighing on me. I can't figure it out. Can we please figure it out? I need analysis here on what just happened. And so I feel like this is why the media, the TV, social media, the news has become what it has become. I think it's because we don't have that tribe. We don't have that circle. We don't have that table to have these heart to heart emotional feelings about what's going on. That the news has turned into kind of like a surrogate friend, social media has turned into the surrogate friend. TV has been the surrogate friend for many people. Now, I would try to say this to people as we were coming up with our matchmaking service and, even the thoughts before the podcast started and people would get all bent out of shape and they would take it so personally, and they would get so offended by me just saying that.

And I'm not saying you are doing this, I'm saying, I've noticed this is what's happening. And I think this is why. Even the news has become the way it has. I remember listening to the news when I was little and it was so God awful boring because it was like the, the anchor, he, or she would be robotic, no expression.

The tone of voice would always remain the same even keeled way. And they would purely spout out facts only. No matter what language it was, the words that were chosen were very unemotional. It didn't have a side to it. Like you wouldn't say this person was in an earthquake, they would say.

This person experienced an earthquake. Do you see the difference?

[00:10:59] Matt: Absolutely.

[00:11:00] Fawn: Is it on purpose or is it just because of a zeitgeisty thing that anchors and newscasters have, try to basically just go along with. The emotion and most oftentimes, you know, we talk about this all the time when you're in a fight, emotion wins over logic.

[00:11:19] Matt: Of course.

[00:11:20] Fawn: And that's what's happening because people have nobody to talk to.

They listen to a certain news show because they need someone else to tell them they're not crazy for feeling what they're feeling. So one side is saying this. And then the other side is saying the opposite because we're all having different points of views. Right. And we are so addicted to staying within that one feeling, because we're not heard for so many years that we don't want to hear anybody else because nobody else has listened to us.

I think that's why there is such a divide right now. And that is why people don't want to listen to another side because they're still hungry to be heard. And I'm not saying this side is right or this side is right. I'm just saying on a very basic human level, there is hunger. And I think that that's what happens.

And I think that's what has happened in that there's this surrogate friend now, and it may be good it may be bad but I think we're all under a spell now of whatever is said. These words cast a spell upon us. And I think that we're in trouble now. And I think that's why it's important to talk to one another aside away from these programs and have real conversations, which is what we're about.

[00:12:47] Matt: Right. And that's of course the fun part, because I almost want like to describe a lot of friendships as being fair weather friends. And as soon as there's a challenging conversation (breaking sound) break up, because I think what we get out of the 24 hour news cycle is, we get kind of a non challenging, thoughts and beliefs.

Now I remember hearing that way, way, way back in the day, Walter Cronkite, who people look at as being the newscaster announced that the Vietnam war couldn't be won. Now, fact or opinion. That's where it gets weird. That was him with his deck of facts, making that claim. And I'm sure there were people in the U S government who felt the other way,

[00:13:30] Fawn: but his influence,

[00:13:31] Matt: he had, he had influence too though, which is an interesting thing.

But I think that, with this advent of the CNNs, the Fox news' 24. You have to fill 24 hours. With quote-unquote news. And so you present it, you make it as non challenging to your audience as possible, as opposed to if I'm the anchorman on, uh, or woman on ABC news. I'm trying to attract everybody.

If I'm CNN, I'm attracting this demographic. If I'm Fox news, I'm attracting that demographic. But if I. You know, ABC, um, trying to attract way more people, NBC, CBS, I'm trying to attract as many people as possible, as opposed to as many people who have these deep seated beliefs. And one of the things I think that we're seeing inside of people's arguments now, when they go to argue a fact is they generally start with, you know, and that's obviously.

And that's where they start. They don't actually start by taking an original thought and defending it. They just say it's obvious. And at this point in time, we've kind of let that slide.

[00:14:42] Fawn: Well, like I'm saying, we've let it slide because we just need a friend to talk to, to commiserate

[00:14:49] Matt: with and a non challenging friend.

And

[00:14:52] Fawn: that is such a need right there to commiserate. Because we don't have that. We don't have our family and I'm talking about friends. Right. We don't have that. So it's, it's like they seized on that opportunity, that weakness. And it's not a weakness per se, but they it's like they sniff that out and that's what they're going with.

And they're shaping the whole world like that. And I, and I want to say, I mean, I don't know, like we haven't traveled in so long. I don't know. Is it like that in France too? Is it like that in South Africa? Is it like that? It, I mean, is it like that in Mexico is it like that. I mean, all of our friends out there is it like that where you are like, has it become a purely emotional thing, the news?

[00:15:47] Matt: Well, stirring the emotional pot is certainly power; is powerful. And, you know, if I tune in ABC news and I'm like, oh, well, that's very interesting. But you know, it's really not at a convenient time. So I'd much rather watch an hour earlier an hour later, I guess I'll watch, you know, uh, NBC, because then they have their nationwide news and hour, whatever.

And I'm okay with that because I'm still getting similar information. But I'm not feeling that connection and I'm not feeling that emotional stuff because let's not forget, as a people, once upon a time, our people a hunted saber tooth tigers. And in order to do such a thing, you need a team, you need a group that's all bonded together for a single purpose.

So it was kind of baked into our DNA. For self protection. So we really want these emotional connections and we really need these physical connections to others. Cause man, at it's heart is a social animal,

[00:16:40] Fawn: I feel like what's happened is they know that we are social animals so that they've created this, this

[00:16:46] Matt: situation. Right. And I think it started with if you buy this laundry powder, your clothes will be cleaner. That makes you smarter.

[00:16:55] Fawn: But there, the situation has been created. And now the spell that I'm talking about is causing us to just stay here because it's at the same time.

It's yeah, you're a social animal. So let me feed you. This I'll be the surrogate, but the thing is that you're still separate . You're under the illusion. You're under the spell that you have a community, but you don't, they're trying to sell toasters, but also beyond that, like, let's take, you know, we've forever from the beginning,

you and I have been so anti-social media. Like just recently I had to get on Facebook. And if you go on our Facebook for our friendly world, it's really Matt's account. I couldn't figure out how to do it. So I just switched my name to your name, but it's still your stuff. Some of your old friends that were, that you didn't have that many people following you, you had like six or nine?

I don't know, but like, I think they were all confused. Like what? Right.

[00:17:56] Matt: I'm sure they all

[00:17:57] Fawn: were because I started posting stuff

[00:18:00] Matt: for years and then all of a sudden, boom, our friendly world. Hey, how's it going

[00:18:04] Fawn: right now? You know, I'm sure some of them are totally bent out of shape. I know there's one very conservative guy.

Who's now like, oh, you know what I mean? Like, cause I'm the one talking, you know, this nonwhite woman talking about stuff. So what I was saying is they're keeping us separated. There's this illusion that we have this tribe, like with Facebook or Instagram or whatever you have. It just, it's, it's an illusion that you have family that you have people that care.

Right. But really they're trying to sell toasters. They're trying to sell their vegan, this and vegan that, and their course, I'm trying to sell this course here. That it is so exhausting. Honestly, and then you have to keep posting to like, be viable, to be out there to be seen. It's it's honestly, it's my least favorite part of doing our show. I love our show. I love doing our show. Well, when it comes down to Sunday night, Monday, or Tuesday, where I have to post about it, I get so tired and like rushed and not joyful. I it's, it's really hard. And I can tell them, like, people are just so superficial, most people except for Wendy, Wendy, my sister.

Oh my God. She is amazing. Yes. Okay. Wendy and others, Wendy and others. Yes. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. They're there. I'm just talking about my Instagram, our Instagram account. Okay. Cause not that many people know about it, so you know, very few people really comment on it. The people who comment are amazing, but it just feels like a chore.

Honestly. Do you know what. To do that. Right. And that's not how it's supposed to be. When you have this gathering at the table, the table could be metaphoric. You have so much more energy. It should not suck your energy. Right. When you're amongst friends and you're sharing ideas and you're sharing your experiences and your thoughts, and you're trying to figure things out.

It is magnificent and the power is so big. I just feel like we're under that spell where we are remaining isolated, that we're not having real conversations in person and in person doesn't have to be face-to-face . This podcast I feel like is in person. I feel like. All of our friends that are listening to us, that, that write to us to talk to us,

that call us up about an idea we just talked about; that is amazing. That is a heart to heart connection. It is real. I just feel like all these programs are keeping us separate and keeping us at a vibration of hate and anger and it's controlling us and please hold that thought. Don't, don't forget.

And I'm almost done. One other point I wanted to make wise what I wanted to say was, I think I am now done with my surrogate friend because now I feel like, okay, enough of commiseration. And now I'm seeing, oh my goodness. All along I've been seeing now I see what you've been doing all along. You've been guiding me to do what you want me to do.

So for example, I'm listening to the news and. Why is it the thing of utmost importance is the supply chain. I understand business is important, but really the most important thing right now is people's health. The most important thing now is what's going on with the climate, what is happening with, you know, there are people who need help that are in earthquakes and hurricanes and tornadoes, fires.

There are so many things happening. Why is it the most important thing is getting presents, getting all the things you need to shop for that is like on the news that has become the most important thing to make sure you can buy and consume what you want, which leads us to this. Treat yourself society.

Have you noticed that, like, I I've noticed that this surrogate friend has now been using me and I can see it, you know, I use them too. I needed someone to commiserate with, but I can see how they're trying to make me buy stuff.

[00:22:48] Matt: Absolutely. Yeah. I think one of the keenest clearest measures that we should have with groups is how do you disagree? Do you disagree? If you, if you never disagree, how do you know that you're connected properly? Quote, unquote, properly. It's about how we disagree. It's about disagreeing respectfully as opposed to well you're just stupid or trolling or any of those other things.

And, and, you know, I know that there are communities I used to, yeah. I used to belong to a community where people would disagree respectfully and it was awesome.

[00:23:23] Fawn: What was that?

[00:23:26] Matt: Shout out to John St. Clair and the build your own arcade controls website. If you sign up there and then you ask for access into their politics board, which I haven't been to in a long time.

So I hope it's still the same. , then you have to you have to write a message to John St Claire and tell him, or St um, and tell him that you understand the rules of the board, which is basically don't be an a-hole. Okay. Then all of a sudden you get access to this politics board and people would disagree.

And you know what? I have my mind changed there by what people had posted, because. We're a smorgasbord, we're a huge group of people and we're going to disagree. There are people who are so convinced they're right, because their grandparents blah-blah-blah, there's other people who are so convinced they're right, because they live in blah-blah-blah and these people are blah-blah-blah and there's other people who see the same people as being blah-blah-blah, which is completely different.

So it's about how we disagree. And it's about disagreeing. If we don't disagree. If you never disagree, if you never get your mind changed or challenged by the things that you're witnessing, are you growing

' cause we need to grow. Everybody needs to grow. Something that I've been talking about lately has been, I wish everybody would use the same deck of facts. Left right center, green, pink, red doesn't matter. I wish they all used the same deck of facts.

Can we really have the

[00:25:02] Fawn: same

[00:25:02] Matt: facts? Well, facts are facts.

And now unfortunately there's an imminent number of them, but if we ignore some facts in favor of other facts,

' cause that's what people do. You can ignore a whole stack of facts make your point.

I was watching, oh my goodness. What was I watching? I was watching the boys from top gear and the old boys from top gear. They were talking about, oh yes. And this, that the other thing. And then, one guy got on another guy was like, yeah, but you were only able to get this many horsepower because you had racing fuel.

And then the other guy bounced back with your car, always needs racing fuel. And the one guy said, oh, I was hoping you didn't know that because it deflated his arguement. Because facts are facts and that's just, it. You make the strongest argument. You can, but what's happened today is people ignore facts or they, they push them to the side.

Or maybe in many cases, they don't know it, if they're getting all of their facts from one place,

[00:26:01] Fawn: it's just what you choose to concentrate on. Okay. I'm going to take it. You're going to get mad at me right now, but bring it back to what you were saying. When you say facts, I always go to racial issues. So let's go back to the spice trade era, right?

The Dutch, the Dutch enslaved, the first they killed off. Most of the people on the islands where they grew nutmeg, all right, this is Indonesia. They killed about 75% of the people. And then the rest of the people that were left, they enslaved . But when you hear about the spice trade and you hear about, oh, the Dutch were great spice traders.

The fact is that they were killers, that they were enslavers. They enslaved people, they killed people and stole their property, nutmeg being one of them. But the fact is what they're spice traders, which fact do we concentrate on, do you know what I mean? Which, which fact are we going to look

[00:26:59] Matt: at?

You look at all the facts. You look at as

many

[00:27:02] Fawn: facts, but the Dutch, but this company who is now trading these spices, the fact is their spice traders. My fact would be they're killers, right.

[00:27:15] Matt: But they're both true and you need to pay attention to both,

[00:27:19] Fawn: but one side will never. Concentrate on the other truth.

[00:27:24] Matt: Well, that's, and that's the point though, is, is both sides need to, like, I just recently found out a whole bunch of mine, a whole bunch. I really kind of messed up things. You ready? I'm ready. So I get emails because I have a very common email address. Uh, I get emails that are meant for me all the time.

[00:27:42] Fawn: So how many thousands of Mathew Andersons are there in the world? Cause you've got Matthew Anderson's in the UK and the United States and Australia. Yes, probably South Africa. Yeah. I'm sorry. Go

[00:27:54] Matt: ahead. All over the place. There's a coach. I'll come to you anyways.

So I recently started recently, like past six months, I got emails from a company because there's a Matthew Anderson, who is an employee. It turns out, um, yeah, they were supporters of Nazis back the day. Supposedly,

Hectic. That's just, it, there's a lot of facts out there. And as facts come to light, we need to figure out what to do with them.

So I get emails from a variety of sources.

One of them is a company that, yeah, whatever it doesn't matter. I recently found out that this company. Um, yeah. Was wholehearted supporters of Nazis back. And I know if you go ahead and Google, there's a fashion company, supposedly that was there's a computer company that supposedly was a, and there's there's companies in other countries where like founders of companies were Nazi sympathizers back in the day.

Uh, there are other companies who, manufactured stuff that was in use by, you know, east German agents (Matt makes continuation sounds) and as we discover these facts, we need to figure out what to do with them. Honestly, as an American discovering, you know, hearing about the manifest destiny, which was, it was the, it was the right of all the settlers to take all this land because it wasn't, I don't know, properly being used.

I don't know what the right arguments are.

[00:29:15] Fawn: Very

[00:29:17] Matt: dispassionately. In elementary school. I'm sorry. Say that

[00:29:21] Fawn: again. What

[00:29:21] Matt: I learned about all I learned about manifest destiny, very dispassionately, uh, in elementary school. And I still remember there was a painting of the trail of tears. If you really take a moment. And like I say, spend a brain cell on and really ponder what that is, it was messed up.

But this picture that was created, this painting, where they describe it, looked like well-dressed people, one was in a wagon and they were just going to from somewhere in the south to Oklahoma, to their reservation in Oklahoma. And. It deflated the argument that this was, this was a horrific thing.

[00:30:01] Fawn: First of all, it's barely a paragraph.

First of all, I was never taught that, that, I mean, right. You can spend a whole master's degree on the trail of tears. Like, you know what I mean? And, and all we got was me. I didn't even get that by the way. Thank God by some miracle, like I get information, I'm able to teach our kids, but all I heard, all I probably saw was that painting you were talking about in school, it was never talked about.

Right,

[00:30:33] Matt: right. And that's just, it there's so many, gosh, darn facts. And, you know, you need to figure it out and figure it out for yourselves.

[00:30:42] Fawn: And cause you always say this history , is told by the victors. And I say the history is told by the bullies who take over stuff and everybody else is, , a Savage. Yes. You know, unhuman, unhuman, not human. So in killing them , it's no big deal. It's

[00:31:01] Matt: ridiculous. And then of course we do take moments to pause and say yes, but Sacagawea helped Lewis and Clark. And the first Thanksgiving was with the Indians who helped the pilgrims. And it all seems rather pleasant until you realized how many quote, unquote Indians, native Americans, first people, whatever you want to call them, had to get pushed out of the way so that I could have my tobacco plantation or whatever it is.

So.

[00:31:30] Fawn: This is a really important topic. Again, one that needs to be discussed fully by really educated people by people whose ancestors have gone through this. And hopefully they have stories. I feel like we're going to do it an injustice by moving to the other thought that I had, please forgive me, but can we veer off to what I was trying to say about us being under a spell right now and how they, the surrogate friend has become this force that is now trying to manipulate you to do certain things. Right. We were talking about consumerism. It reminds me of when there is a neglected child, when a parent, you know, have you seen those parents that have no time for their children?

They're always working. They barely are present. They're in the same room, even you're not fully present, you're not seeing each other. You're not hearing each other. I feel like that's become our society. And what I'm about to describe as like the parent child dynamic of buying a child stuff to replace the fact that there wasn't attention placed upon this child

so if you don't have time, or if you don't have the bandwidth to really be present for your child, you just buy your child things. This is what wealthy people who can do that do. Right. You just, you just get them stuff. Right. And I feel like the American society has kind of gone to that with. We're experiencing all this trauma; and instead of fixing it, instead of talking about it and instead of healing it and getting to the core and being present with what's truly bothering everyone, we're saying, treat yourself. I deserve this. And it's that entitled mentality that has taken over our society. Like I deserve this.

We, we don't think it a big deal when we turn on the light switch and there's electricity, there's a light. We don't think it's a big deal to just go to the sink and turn on the water and water, clean water. Well, not everybody has clean water. Most of us don't, there's all kinds of stuff in water.

Don't get me here. Um, don't get me started on that. But what I'm saying is , there's water. Do you know what I mean there, or the fact that there's water on the planet or that we have oxygen to breathe. Don't take that for granted. But we have this entitlement that has become such a barrier for us to really connect with one another, because stuff has taken the place of having true connection. So, you know, yeah. Now we're watching the news and to make us feel better, go by this. Oh, the world is burning. Let's fix those supply chains so you can buy stuff. What I'm trying to get at is the treat yourself society. Treat yourself.

Where's that coming from. And how is that bringing us closer together? I think it's creating more isolation. Treat yourself. Me Me Me!,

[00:34:37] Matt: right? Don't be challenged. Don't be disagreed with comfort

[00:34:41] Fawn: and it's the American dream to have everything that you want. It's the American dream. It's like, it's like the slogan that we hear all the time.

Everybody wants to come to the United States. It's the American dream. Is it? W what kind of dream is it where we're not even a family? We're always fighting. They're always shootings. The fact is most people are lonely.

Most people don't even know how to sit together and be comfortable together. It's all about their bubble, their space.

How did major consumerism come in and why I'll tell you why? I think it's to keep you separate it's to keep you satiated when, what you really need is a friend, what you really need is companionship. And what you really need is to have a talk about how you're feeling, what you really need is to express what you've been through.

[00:35:33] Matt: Advertising grew from a need for a company to grow consume, and it has trans morphed into how do we manipulate people into doing what we want them to do, which is consume more, and certainly, the economy is better when money circulating through and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

So

[00:35:55] Fawn: have you noticed when there's a time of fear, they use fear to sell. If you look at most commercials, if you don't get this, you're not going to have a good life. They put a fear factor in there, so you need that product. There's always an element of fear in most commercials.

[00:36:13] Matt: Always big words. It's tricky that way, but certainly a lot of the marketing that happens for those of you who don't, when you have a little kid, when you have a, you know, a baby, is your baby keeping up with all the other babies and the commercialism does play right on into that.

Like, if you don't get your kids, this access to this website, or you don't get them these books, or you don't play with them a certain way, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And everything's about your child and the chart, there's a growth and a weight and height chart. There's a cognitive whatever chart. And it's all just fear, fear, fear.

A

lot

[00:36:50] Fawn: of it. I mean, it's everywhere it is. If you don't get into this certain university, you'll never make it. You know, universities have commercials and in ways you don't even suspect that you're hearing a commercial. Like I said, it's all a spell that we're under.

[00:37:08] Matt: A lot of

[00:37:08] Fawn: it is.

Absolutely. And the thing is the spell would be broken if we actually got together and spoke, Like how we're speaking now, but more of us talking, like, I wish, I wish our friends who listened to us could join in on the show and we could have a conversation. Right.

[00:37:24] Matt: And maybe disagree respectfully, which would be a really good thing.

Exactly. Because we don't, there's not enough disagreeing, respectfully. It's all gotten very

[00:37:33] Fawn: nasty. Well, because we're not heard yet. We're not like I.

[00:37:40] Matt: Absolutely. And it's also because we do have a certain element of anonymity, so that affords us the opportunity to just be a complete a-hole.

[00:37:50] Fawn: It's very robotic.

Like it's all algorithms and everything created by some companies like Facebook. Who are you really talking to?

[00:37:59] Matt: Yeah. Who are you really talking to? How are you being curated? How are you being manipulated?

[00:38:05] Fawn: Manipulated. Anyway, we just went totally off, off, off the subject. But what I was saying was sometimes there's a surrogate friend and you have to understand it's a surrogate friend, it's a substitute, and you may need that.

That suits its purpose. For me, the purpose was I needed to come commiserate. I just needed that. And as soon as I felt fueled enough by that, but not field to the point of a rage where I'm brainwashed, I started to see other things like, oh my God, what you're you want me to buy? Buy, buy constantly. Like, that's your point?

I'm here to make the world better. Luckily by the grace of some force out there, I was able to see it and catch myself, you know, and know, that's what I was doing. I desperately needed someone to have the same thoughts that I was having. So I don't feel as crazy for having the thoughts. I'm having to have it be bounced back a little bit back and forth.

That's what I needed. We have to be really careful. That's it? I don't even know how to bring this around. I mean, I really just wanted to have the surrogate friend saying, you know, it's needed. I just feel like we totally took it to an evil conspiracy. Like the world is so messed up right now kind of deal. And it's not it.

W what I'm trying to say is like, let's just have conversations together, right? Have

[00:39:38] Matt: conversations. Let's disagree, respectfully let's challenge each other respectfully, and hopefully grow as a people.

[00:39:47] Fawn: Surrogates should be for a little bit of. Yes.

[00:39:51] Matt: There's this can be helpful for a limited amount of time. Yes. Yeah.

[00:39:57] Fawn: You need, I mean, I just, I just caught myself saying you don't need a surrogate. You do need a second sometimes. Sometimes, and it's beneficial sometimes. So that's it. Um, how do we make this happy before we go?

[00:40:12] Matt: That's a good question. Thanks for dumping that on laugh. How do we make it happy? Um,

[00:40:19] Fawn: how to make

[00:40:19] Matt: it light? Just know that, I mean, certainly for me, I don't agree on a political spectrum. Uh, majority of my friends and we touch and on these subjects and we talk about these subjects and I hear the frustrations and the non frustrations.

And I think it helps me understand where they're coming from that I listen. And then, because I listen, they listened to my side. We may still completely disagree and be at loggerheads, but I'm not. Aggressively trying to make this person change their mind. I'm not aggressively trying to express my rage at, you know, their raw stupidity, because I don't feel that way because I respect my friends because I love my friends.

And, you know, it's about everybody, all the people in the conversation growing

[00:41:14] Fawn: and with me. I would like, I just want to be quiet. I'm so tired of talking about trying to express what I see, do you know what I mean? I'm not tired of talking the podcast. I'm tired of explaining. And I, I just want peace and no arguments for awhile.

Honestly, I just want quiet. I want to eat and drink and enjoy, enjoy the earth and clean things up right. Quietly. That's what I want to do. Right.

[00:41:46] Matt: You want to eat, you want to drink, you want to heal and get

[00:41:49] Fawn: it and heal and heal and help each other heal. Right. And I think that's where I want to close it off.

Is there anything else you want to add? Nope.

All right. Thank you for listening . Please go to our website, our friendly world podcast.com. There's a little donate button, any few pennies, whatever will help us so much. Thank you. Thanks for listening. Seriously, love to all of you. We appreciate you so much. Love you.

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